How President Obama Damaged the United States
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Harrison
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appeasement cia CIA interrogation methods Democrats interogation Iran Liberals man-created disaster Obama Obamaspeak Terrorism Torture
Dont worry, there will be regular bathroom breaks.
Let’s say you hated the United States and everything it stood for and, because of these feelings, you wanted to kill as many Americans as you possibly could so as to strike a blow against the “Great Satan” (Iran’s preferred term) and you were intent, in Obamaspeak, in making a “man-created disaster” (terrorist act). Let’s say you recruited a few other like-minded individuals but, before you could put your plan into motion, you were captured. Let’s say that the CIA managed to get ahold of you and you were interrogated to see what you knew.
Now let’s stop for a moment… in most countries you wouldn’t know what was going to happen to you. But let’s say you had a chance to read, before you were captured, the memos that President Obama released about CIA interrogation methods. You could breathe easy because you’d know:
Future terrorist detainees will now know, for instance, that their interrogations are under continual video surveillance to make sure no lasting medical or psychological consequences result from the techniques used. Will they now teach themselves to fake such ill effects?
Terrorists will know that when they are placed in a tiny container in “cramped confinement” it will last only “up to two hours,” as a declassified memo from the Justice Department to the CIA noted. They will know that “stress positions” are used “only to induce temporary muscle fatigue” not “severe physical pain.”
They will now know that when subjected to “water dousing” they need not have the slightest fear of hypothermia, because every precaution is taken to keep the temperature of both the room and the water itself far above freezing.
They will know sleep deprivation inflicted by the interrogators seldom exceeds 96 hours, and they’ll know the specifics and purposes behind the relatively mild technique of “dietary manipulation.”
Terrorist groups around the world will now know that waterboarding was “authorized for, at most, one 30-day period, during which the technique can actually be applied on no more than five days” with “no more than two sessions in any 24-hour period.”
Each session lasted no more than two hours, consisting of, at most, six applications of water for 10 seconds each time, for a total of no longer than 12 minutes per each 24-hour period. Presumably the issue is academic since the Obama administration has officially prohibited waterboarding.
In other words, you would know the gameplan of your enemy. If you knew what they could and could not do to you and you could keep calm during this process then you would be able to remain in control of your knowledge which means the good guys (the Americans in case you are wondering) would not be able to learn of your plans and your “man-created disaster” might still go off without a hitch.
This type of inexcusable breech of intelligence is one of the stupidest things I’ve heard of ever. It ranks right up there with smoking while pumping gasoline or wearing a steak on your face while jumping into a polar bear enclosure.
Liberals will preach that it was for the “good” of the world that our enemies now know of our methods because it was “wrong” to get people to provide information that could save innocent lives, that somehow with this information out there the American-hating, flag-burring posse (and I don’t just mean Code Pink) will now embrace the U.S. and our goodwill bank account will overflow and we will somehow stop all terrorist activities, I mean man-made disasters, from happening.
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Remember, it was all our fault.
Maybe I should tell Liberals there is no Tooth Fairy while I’m at it?
The only advantage one can have in any negotiation (and getting infomation from someone who does not want to give it is a negotiation) is the leverage of uncertainty. It is now like playing a chess game but telling your opponent to mind their Knight because you will try and take it with your Rook in the next three moves.
The American public, and the world, are unable to judge how successful this program was because while President Obama ordered the release of these legal memos he did not authorize the CIA’s memos which showed how well the program worked according to former Vice President Dick Cheney:
“One of the things that I find a little bit disturbing about this recent disclosure is they put out the legal memos, the memos that the CIA got from the Office of Legal Counsel, but they didn’t put out the memos that showed the success of the effort. And there are reports that show specifically what we gained as a result of this activity. They have not been declassified.”
I find the fact that only the methods were released but not the results to be highly suspect because the additional memos would most likely show what was accomplished in terms of innocent lives saved. But if President Obama did that then he would have some very tough questions to answer from the American people about why he was doing what he was doing.
President Obama has done this country a grave disservice in releasing this information. He has hampered intelligence gathering efforts, betrayed people who have devoted their lives towards protecting this country and, because it will become much more difficult to learn what information a terrorist knows it will open this country up to more attacks because it will be harder to learn of and prevent them.
A note to Liberals on this point: It is commonsense not fear mongering!
This nation has become soft. We are dealing with people who would not think even once about blowing themselves up in order to kill as many innocent people as possible. We are dealing with people who capture, hold hostage, film, and behead innocent people. We are dealing with people who misuse religion to preach hatred and to destroy lives. They will use every single advantage they have to reach their goals. And President Obama just gave them a huge advantage.
As President Obama cozies up to people like the President of Iran and Venezula who openly call for the fall of the United States one has to ask themselves which country he supposedly leads?
For those Americans who applaud the release of this information I have but two quotations for you to consider:
“We sleep safely at night because rough men stand ready to visit violence on those who would harm us.”
“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf”
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9:34 AM
Harrison,
Your post sounded like the same old Republican fear-mongering that we heard from Bush and Cheney for an unbearable eight years. The last time I checked, the U.S. was still a nation of laws, some of which deal with the torturing of prisoners. Bush had no regard for these laws because he thought it was okay to bring ourselves down to the level of terrorists. The ultra-conservative nut jobs think that every problem in the world can be settled with an AK-47, or water-boarding, or electrical shocks or cutting off some one’s balls. Get with it, Harrison, the swaggering cowboy days of George Bush are over. Obama didn’t “damage the reputation” of the United States by putting light on the crimes of Bush and Cheney; he enhanced it by letting friend and foe know that evil will be exposed, even when it occurs at the highest levels.
askcherlock’s last blog post..Who Said It’s Not Easy Being Green?
9:41 AM
You did not address any of the issues raised in the article but instead resorted to the tried and true tactic of changing the subject. And I never said President Obama damaged the “reputation” of the U.S. more that he damaged the security.
Next time, try responding to the points made not inserting hyperbole. Thanks for your comment.
11:37 AM
Harrison,
There’s no hyperbole here, just the truth. You said Obama “did this country a grave dis-service”, and “Obama gave them (the terrorists) a huge advantage”, and Obama “cozies up to people like the President of Iran and Venezuela”, and “betrayed people who have devoted their lives toward protecting this country. . . ” My point was that you have harshly condemned our president for bringing illegal activities to light, and for establishing new parameters for interrogations that do not encompass torture. This does not make America a weaker country.
askcherlock’s last blog post..Who Said It’s Not Easy Being Green?
11:56 AM
Firstly, those activities were not “illegal.” Secondly, when Obama “ended” those techniques he left the door open to use them again at the discretion of the AG so your casting of the situation is incorrect. If you do not believe me read the entire Executive Order he signed so, in effect, our president is a hypocrite on this matter.
Letting anybody know your game plan gives them an advantage, this is a fact. And many in the intelligence community, who loyally serve their country, do feel betrayed, especially in light of today’s announcement that these people could be “prosecuted” (read Democratic show trials to score political points). Why else would Obama have personally spoken to the CIA the other day?
Lastly, I find it very interesting that you pay no regard to the innocent lives that were saved (including a plot to blow up L.A.’s tallest office building) all to “protect” a handful of people who would have no regard for slitting your throat and those of your friends and family.
And you missed the part that said:
“Future terrorist detainees will now know, for instance, that their interrogations are under continual video surveillance to make sure no lasting medical or psychological consequences result from the techniques used.”
If you want to see torture look at Daniel Pearl.
3:54 PM
Askcherlock forgot to include Hellfire missile fired from drones as a tool that can solve every problem in the world.
Liberals will whine about torture. It is inevitable. Ask them to come up with an alternative way of extracting information and they don’t have any ideas worth discussing.
Regardless of this fact, enemies of America have proven that it doesn’t take much to extract information from the American state. Look at how effective they were in getting the highest powers in the land to glowingly publish sensitive, classified information.
Maybe we should abandon torture and follow the model that our enemies have followed to encourage us to give them sensitive information. Unfortunately, terrorist organizations don’t typically have weak liberal factions as part of their constituencies for us to exploit.
Treason is another one of those words that has lost its meaning. Here is how the Constitution defines it:
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort
Burro’s last blog post..Top Ten Industries besides Assault Weapons that Liberals should Ban
4:15 PM
The main thing, which is always ignored, are the results. I find this sadly amusing.
5:11 PM
I oppose the use of torture for legal and moral reasons, but I agree with you that releasing our methods of interrogation to the public is unbelievably stupid.
Independent-American’s last blog post..Have the Republicans Discovered Obama’s Achilles Heel?
7:48 PM
We can discuss hypotheticals all day long but the facts remain:
“Future terrorist detainees will now know, for instance, that their interrogations are under continual video surveillance to make sure no lasting medical or psychological consequences result from the techniques used.”
There were no deaths, only innocent lives saved.
BTW the NYTimes article for which you provided a link had nothing to do with your question regarding the death of a suspect.
7:54 PM
When this country was invaded by the most powerful army on earth, our first commander in chief, George Washington, insisted on treating prisoners humanely. This was contrary to the British practice by the way. When the British burned down our capital in the war of 1812, we still refused to torture prisoners. When the country was in civil war, and spies were everywhere, we still did not resort to torture. When we were involved in two world wars, we did not need to torture. When we were in an arms race with the Soviet Union which was determined to steal our most precious military secrets, and which had the power to annihilate us with nuclear weapons, we did not need to torture prisoners.
We face no threat greater than those prior threats, and we still have no need to torture prisoners. And I don’t care if every terrorist in the world knows that the United States of America will never torture them. In fact, I hope that every terrorist in the world knows that. We do not need to surrender our ideals and our humanity to defeat this enemy.
Joe Markowitz’s last blog post..Dealing with Torture
8:09 PM
I guess you forget that President Lincoln suspended habeas corpus and I guess you didn’t know about the 8 Germans captured in New Jersey during WW2 that were tried by the military and 6 were executed under orders from FDR who refused to allow them civilian trials. Lastly, the terrorists captured by the U.S. have hardly been treated in any way similarly to how the British treated American colonists. Gitmo residents get excellent healthcare, food that goes with their religious beliefs, and most of them have become fat as a result of their “harsh” treatment at the hands of the Americans.
8:27 PM
No problems. You attend a fine university, I almost went there.
8:56 PM
I think the most interesting aspect of the torture debate, and whether or not the memos should have been released, is the morally relative hypocrisy of liberalism. On one hand, Liberalism promotes robbery from the wealthy (taxation of AIG employees), illegal drug use (legalization of marijuana), and sexual promiscuity (gay marriage, prostitution). Yet on the other hand, it detests torture. I don’t get it. Things that will ultimately destroy the foundation of any society are championed, while things, albeit unpleasant like torture, that might actually protect innocent lives is detested. Riddle me that!
blogdor’s last blog post..Earth Hour
9:00 PM
On the one hand Liberalism seems to be about placing the value of the individual above that of the State while, at the same time, holds the belief that only through “better” government can the individual truly be “free.” To be fair, it is difficult to find any ideology which does not have some contradictions but you raise an interesting point.
I would disagree with you on the gay “marriage” topic.
2:25 PM
The reason these methods were declassified by Obama was because he doesn’t intend to use these methods any longer. What difference is it to the terrorists? They are willing to blow them selves up for there cause. Do you think that the threat of any kind of torture is going to deter them from committing terrorism? I think not. The only ones who are damaging the United States is the people who refuse to support any of Obama’s policies and critize every move he makes to correct the mistakes Bush and Cheney made.
Bob’s last blog post..New Blog Template
10:20 PM
I found this in an article in the Washington Post:
Critics claim that enhanced techniques do not produce good intelligence because people will say anything to get the techniques to stop. But the memos note that, “as Abu Zubaydah himself explained with respect to enhanced techniques, ‘brothers who are captured and interrogated are permitted by Allah to provide information when they believe they have reached the limit of their ability to withhold it in the face of psychological and physical hardship.” In other words, the terrorists are called by their faith to resist as far as they can — and once they have done so, they are free to tell everything they know. This is because of their belief that “Islam will ultimately dominate the world and that this victory is inevitable.” The job of the interrogator is to safely help the terrorist do his duty to Allah, so he then feels liberated to speak freely.
This is the secret to the program’s success. And the Obama administration’s decision to share this secret with the terrorists threatens our national security. Al-Qaeda will use this information and other details in the memos to train its operatives to resist questioning and withhold information on planned attacks.
It is nice to know that these interrogation tactics grew out of the liberal ideology of multiculturalism. If you ask me, this brand of torture is cultural sensitivity at its best.
Burro’s last blog post..Top Ten Industries besides Assault Weapons that Liberals should Ban
10:21 PM
Sorry,
Here is the link to the article:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/20/AR2009042002818.html?hpid%3Dopinionsbox1
Burro’s last blog post..Top Ten Industries besides Assault Weapons that Liberals should Ban